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Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 0736
I think i found a possible generator that has overunity - the Bedini Generator...

So to test this little gen, i'll be running four of them to charge a 48 volts sytem "AGM batteries" which will be installed into this summers project...

WINTER PROJECT - Hubless Chopper...

SUMMER PROJECT - Forward Trike...

Im taking whats left of my drag scooter, actually the back half and attaching to the front half of my gutted quad runner - marry the two to create a forward trike - seating will be set low like a go kart... 48 volt system using my 48 volt kelly controller and with the four bedini generators on board...

photos of the project coming soon, very soon...

but for now the bedini motor/generator...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttY7yLXZSpo

this time im getting help from people who are more knowledgeable about building these things...

here is and ideal of the trike i want to create...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8X3nCX_2IZE&feature=related

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 0754
:p my apologies - im mean reverse trike...

frodus
01 May 2012, 0813
You got sucked into the bedini scam too? Don't waste your money. Get a propane/cng/gas powered genset and be done.

No such thing as overunity. Period.

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 0935
im in another forum of electronic folks who actually are building and perfecting these motor/generators - some of the fellows are working on regulating the output for lithium batteries - right now they are charging lead batteries successfully...

the trick is in the coil winding, very important - but i have to disagree, overunity is possible... as the example of this build will show that ...

i would like to prove it right now, but its not my place to do so - these fellows treat there ideals the way we do ours, they dont mind sharing, but do want to be recognized for it...

i will introduce you to them later...

larryrose11
01 May 2012, 0948
somthing like this?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yJPTSaARlvs

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1022
hey larry hows it going - i found the 1/2" diameter roller bearing i need and the bearing steel to encase it with from my girlfriends bearing plant... my friends at the machine shop are awaiting for me get a wheel they can lathe...

but for the moment im putting most of my money into the battery cells i need to get the chopper running...

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1023
this from VTECH - Hi Allen,

You wind a coil clockwise. When you done, mark start and end on the spool. Set it on the table so the end is up. This is the way you'll have to mount, so the end will be facing wheel magnets. Magnets have N poles facing out. Coil when energized will be polarized N-S, just like magnet .Start wires will go: - trigger to ground and second wire to collector. End wires: trigger to bulb and base resistor and second wire to input positive.

Hope this helps

Vtech

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1026
basicly - im making a motor and a generator with the same coil - two separate magnet wires wound clockwise on the same spool - this is known as the trigger coil and the charging coil - the results have been impressive... some claim 500 winds, but Bedini claims 800 to 900 winds, thats a lot of wire doubled...

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1040
These are the two that is going to get married into one...

podolefsky
01 May 2012, 1047
Watched the video. Just because the voltage is increasing doesn't mean energy is going into the battery.

In order to prove that this works, you'd have to charge two identical batteries to the same level and hook them up to the motor/generator. Then take them out and discharge them to see how much energy each has. Then compare the total energy of both cells before and after.

But...doesn't matter. Over unity isn't possible. The energy always has to come from somewhere, and in every one of these devices the energy source is hidden somehow. I'm not saying they do it on purpose, these folks probably do believe they made an over unity device. They just think it's coming out of thin air when it's actually not.

The thing you have to realize is that you can't measure energy directly. You have to measure some observable thing (like voltage), and then you assume this corresponds to energy. The problem is, it doesn't always...and if it looks like energy is being created, then you know your assumptions are wrong.

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1108
i understand Noah, overunity isnt possible... i do agree the energy has to come from somewhere...

has anyone here built this motor yet - i can give detailed instructions on how to do it... a small cost of radio shack parts and some rare earth magnets to prove it wrong... some bearings and a wheel...

if you do try this experiment for yourself, do not use lithium batteries - the fellows are having trouble doing so at this point, they keep blowing up...

frodus
01 May 2012, 1109
Never does he measure current in/out of the battery.

scoot440
01 May 2012, 1112
Whether it works or not, I look forward to seeing the build and learning from your experiment.

liveforphysics
01 May 2012, 1209
Omg.... Bedini.... I thought this forum was smarter than that.

Everything Bedini related should also be played with this video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfPJeDssBOM&feature=fvwrel

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1212
I'll be cutting up the drag scooter and the quad runner this week - i have plenty of steel tubing and materials for building it - plenty of lead batteries - wheels and such - the real cost will be the motor...

this is one of those projects that should be a fun build...

i will also be modifying the A-arms, to make them wider for better stability - single seater of course...

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1214
Omg.... Bedini.... I thought this forum was smarter than that.

Everything Bedini related should also be played with this video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfPJeDssBOM&feature=fvwrel


WOW... who'd a Thunk It... a onion battery!!!

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1232
Dont judge this forum or the good folks here because i choose to look outside of the box. someone has to try, so blame it on me...

when this generator is built what will it take to prove it - i could show it in a video, and people will still call it a hoax, i could give you the schematics so you can build it for yourself and still people will call fowl...

these are my findings and its my money and my time spent - i refuse not to try to discover a better way, even if i end up with egg on my face. so again dont blame everyone else here for my experiments...

John Wayland would have never built the white zombie, simply because an electrical engineer said a electric vehicle can never pull quicker than 18 seconds on the drag strip...

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1327
oh one other thing - the motor im going to use for the reverse trike is the ME0909... its a low volt motor, but should work good enough for this project...

liveforphysics
01 May 2012, 1329
Dont judge this forum or the good folks here because i choose to look outside of the box. someone has to try, so blame it on me...

when this generator is built what will it take to prove it - i could show it in a video, and people will still call it a hoax, i could give you the schematics so you can build it for yourself and still people will call fowl...

these are my findings and its my money and my time spent - i refuse not to try to discover a better way, even if i end up with egg on my face. so again dont blame everyone else here for my experiments...

John Wayland would have never built the white zombie, simply because an electrical engineer said a electric vehicle can never pull quicker than 18 seconds on the drag strip...


Thousands of fools have made them Allen. You're more than welcome to join the ranks. Nobody has ever had any success, only confused folks who don't understand what a buck-converter is, or that you can make one with a rotary motion for your expanding and contracting field rather than just the core of a transformer. It's so absurdly simple, you put some energy into attracting a magnet, release the field as it spins by, as the magnet passes the other coil it induces a voltage into it and slows the magnet proportional to the amount of energy it induced -losses. It adds X amount of rotational energy to the rotating magnet as it passes by the drive coil, this energy comes from the drive battery. As it goes by the receiving coil, it extracts this energy in the form of slowing the wheel as it induces a voltage into the receiving coil.

You could make the input coil 100-turns and the output coil 1000-turns, and it will output 1/10th the input current at 10x the voltage. If you make the drive coil 1000-turns and the output coil 100 turns, you can output 10x the current you input, but at 1/10th the voltage. Neither way does anything useful happen, you just burn about ~20% of your input power as waste heat from the inefficiency of the power conversion. However! Folks get super excited if they wind it so it outputs higher voltage than it's input voltage, or if they wind it to output higher current than it's input current, either way it's always just wasting power as it converts from one current and voltage to another.

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1341
heat is the issue, great amount of energy is thrown out because of it. the over unity is a small amount, but it is over unity. much improvement is needed, but possible...

i dont mind being a fool - people call me that all the time, simply because i believe that, an electric vehicle can be considered as transportation...

podolefsky
01 May 2012, 1345
John Wayland would have never built the white zombie, simply because an electrical engineer said a electric vehicle can never pull quicker than 18 seconds on the drag strip...

The difference is that nothing about the White Zombie breaks the laws of physics. It only breaks the wrong thinking of one engineer (who didn't know what he was talking about).

We're really not trying to be critical, Allen. Just trying to save you some time and money so you can spend it on something that will actually work.

Allen_okc
01 May 2012, 1359
:D I know Noah, and please be critical - coming from you fellows here, is taken by me with the greatest respect. i look up to you all for the inspiration you have placed upon me...

im just trying to come up with solutions, even when its far fetched and foolishly crazy...

and liveforphysics is my greatest critic, if i ever get to meet him in person, i would proudly shake his hand as a friend. much respect to him. if i was half as smart as him, i would'nt be doing silly experiments... and i mean that respectfully...

liveforphysics
01 May 2012, 1614
the over unity is a small amount, but it is over unity. much improvement is needed, but possible...

No. This is not true in any way Allen. There is no over-unity, it does not create energy in any form. It takes energy from a battery and converts some of it into heat and some into swirling air around something spinning, and transfers some of it into the other battery. It takes charge from one battery and shuffles some into another battery while wasting at least 20% of that energy.

It's just using a wheel with magnets to create it's expanding and contracting magnetic field rather than the core of a transformer doing the same thing without needing something to spin. You can take a transformer and a circuit to switch it to AC, wind it with two separate sets of windings that don't even touch anywhere, and charge one battery from the other battery. You could wind it to take in 10v and output 10,000v, you could wind it to take in 1amp and output 100amps, but the current or voltage will always vary by the amount the other one changed, so if you go up 10x in voltage, you have 1/10th the current, if you go up 10x in current, you go down to 1/10th the voltage etc.

liveforphysics
01 May 2012, 1625
and liveforphysics is my greatest critic, if i ever get to meet him in person, i would proudly shake his hand as a friend. much respect to him.


Thanks Allen, I would happily shake your hand as well, and buy you lunch and we could talk sometime. :-)

Skeezmour
01 May 2012, 1636
Thanks Allen, I would happily shake your hand as well, and buy you lunch and we could talk sometime. :-)

Never a dull moment around you LFP :) See you in a couple days!

So looking forward to trying out one of the 2012 bikes!

billmi
02 May 2012, 0503
Here's a video explaining what a Bedini motor is, and showing one being built and operated.

The Bedini motor portion starts at 5:56.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnJpMX-GXcg

It's nothing more than a motor spinning a generator. Since generators are really just transducers, converting kinetic energy to electrical, I don't understand the thought process behind expecting one to generate more power than is required to spin it.

Allen_okc
02 May 2012, 0557
i guess i missed my calling, just call me the drama king...

anyway a sad day for me, i start cutting up my scooter and the quad runner, pics later...

for now im going to drop the bit about any miracle generator, i wont bring it up again - i do want to share the build of this reverse trike with you all.

as for its size it will be a bit larger than go kart size, kind of a smaller version of the bigger version i will build later. otherwise i got a scooter frame and quad runner frame going to waste...

one other thing did anyone watch the TV Show Dream Machines - the Parker brothers built an electric car for Auto Trader using headway cells and a motor rated at 500 horsepower... pretty kewl looking machine...

http://parkerbrothersconcepts.com/projects/autotrader/project-autotrader.html

Allen_okc
02 May 2012, 0601
:( back to the subject, photos before they get cut up...

podolefsky
02 May 2012, 0917
Nice! Now THAT I can get behind.

Allen_okc
02 May 2012, 1052
:o Hey Noah - dont tell anyone, but i think i cried today... :o

liveforphysics
02 May 2012, 1135
:o Hey Noah - dont tell anyone, but i think i cried today... :o

Are you cutting it up just to re-use $20 in tubing?

Allen_okc
02 May 2012, 1221
basically just to save me a lot of work - i have plenty of tubing...

the quad runner is a must cut up, because of the frame parts i need...

im going to modify the a-arms make them longer for stability... the rest of it i need...

Allen_okc
04 May 2012, 1035
:cool: here is an up to date photo's - with the a-arms stretched out and roadster front wheels it should look a lot better...

:O right now it looks kinda different - i will be putting a steering wheel on it too...

Allen_okc
07 May 2012, 0809
:cool: i need to tell you all that this scooter has gone through so many changes as the photos in this video will show - its been my greatest teacher. rather than let it die in a pile of dust, i want to turn it into something fun to ride and to let it continue to be my teacher...
When all modifications are finished this is what it should look like when its done... then onto a bigger version...

One note - when i start from scratch, ground up frame building of the larger version, it should look like a formula one car...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeA85SHBzW0&feature=youtu.be

billmi
07 May 2012, 1831
That looks like it's going to be a very fun machine :-)

Allen_okc
08 May 2012, 0506
:cool: Thank You Bill - this is going to be the shop toy - we have a circle dirt track out back...

modifying the A-Arms... :D much better...

Allen_okc
09 May 2012, 0518
:D i finally got all four a-arms done, but i wanted to show this photo to demonstrate how wide the front end will be...

Allen_okc
09 May 2012, 1304
:cool: some more updates - needs taller front wheels and double the amount of shocks up front should work great...

:confused: next construction will be of the steering wheel and tie rods...

Allen_okc
16 May 2012, 0804
:O even though ive been having to deal with oil company employees, that hasnt stopped the build of this reverse trike...

Allen_okc
01 June 2012, 1151
:p here is the update of the reverse trike, slightly modified - the same but different...

should be painting the next week - just add a motor and batteries, i have everything else for it...

:cool: on another note the chopper should be with its full set of batteries and ready for the DMV, so i can start riding it to work - YEAH!!!

moon
01 June 2012, 2024
Haha, wow, that is so cool! Looking forward to seeing the progress.

Allen_okc
14 June 2012, 1044
the frame is ready for touch up welding, grinding and then paint - after all that its time to start wiring it for the 48 volt system - mars motor, kelly controller, four odyssey batteries...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XCy6tFeSsA&list=UUEgZRaUYkvRXKktUXLVwSng&index=1&feature=plpp_video

HMMMmmmm...