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Allen_okc
17 September 2012, 0942
:mad: Well you would think, if you buy a motorcycle frame from a motorcycle wrecking yard - all you would need is a bill of sale, have the highway patrol check the vin number, and with there paperwork goto the DMV and get a title and tags... well not this time in Oklahoma...

it was all set and down to the final at the DMV - all they had to do was verify the VIN number and everything would be good to go...

OH NO, not if the arse hole is a Honda Shadow Fan - one look and he said this isnt a Honda Shadow, this is a fabricated motorcycle...

Which is funny, because the their web site claims that custom, kit or fabricated motorcycle are warmly welcomed in the state of Oklahoma and i quote;

http://www.dmv.org/ok-oklahoma/custom-built-cars.php

well, so far i've had to find all receipts, serial numbers, address from where i purchased the parts and a price paid - a long process of digging through every little piece of paper i kept or didnt keep - a photograph and the form 761A-MC not a form called 4761 as their web site claims, on top of that it has to be notorized and filed to the OTC, Oklahoma Tax Commissioner, which is where im at at this point...

with OTC's blessing, im sure its back to OHP "Oklahoma Highway Patrol" for a final inspection to see if any part is stolen and that the bike has all the safety features required for the street " headlight, turn signals, brake lights and so on"...

Warmly welcomed my Arse - anyway i'll keep everyone informed on what it takes to put a EV on the road here in Oklahoma...

electriKAT
17 September 2012, 1137
Sorry to hear it Allen. The rules vary from state to state. But I've heard quite a few horror stories about registering salvaged vehicles. You might see if a nearby state has different rules for getting a title for a salvaged vehicle. That way you could take the out of state title to your DMV and they'd never have to see the bike.

Allen_okc
17 September 2012, 1333
i hear you eletriKAT - i could of done it that way and still can, but i needed to see how much of a pain in the arse my state is about EV's - cause i plan to build a lot more of them... so they maybe putting me through a lot of bull, but they are the ones being tested for the whole world to see...

Richard230
17 September 2012, 1437
When I get the runaround from a DMV office around here, I just go to another one and that usually solves the problem. Some DMV bureaucrats just like to hassle the customers to make up for a bad day. :mad:

Allen_okc
18 September 2012, 0519
Thank You Richard - that was my impression about the inspector who was checking the VIN number - i know if anyone else who didnt or know little about motorcycles wouldnt have forced me to go through the fabricate vehicle route...

who knows maybe he has a relative who works on a oil rig, i thought about that too...

Allen_okc
18 September 2012, 0650
the oklahoma tax commission wants me to go visit them personally - im leaving now - i'll tell you all how it goes...

Richard230
18 September 2012, 0728
the oklahoma tax commission wants me to go visit them personally - im leaving now - i'll tell you all how it goes...

You have to visit a Tax Commission? That can't be good. :O

Good Luck!

Allen_okc
18 September 2012, 0811
here in oklahoma all vehicle registrations go through OTC "Oklahoma Tax Commission"...

i just got back from there and this is how it went;

first of all they showed me a list that i needed to show proof of purchase for, stuff like...

Frame - Fenders - Engine - Transmission - exhaust - speedometer - wheels - forks... actually it was a short list...

i had receipts from paypal that showed description and price and date of purchase - i had everything, i actually over whelmed them with paperwork...

so they took all the paperwork along with detailed photos of the bike - they told me it will probably be a couple of weeks before they let me know...

i will keep this thread in detail step by step of what it takes to register a fabricated EV in the state of Oklahoma - hopefully it will help others...

Richard230
18 September 2012, 1439
That sure sounds a lot more trouble than in California. I think here all you need is a rolling frame with a valid VIN. I don't think they care what gets attached to the frame. :confused:

Allen_okc
28 September 2012, 1400
:O Well its been over a week now and still no word - if i havent received a word from OTC by Thursday, then i'll start bugging them...

:mad: you dont think that maybe an oil well in the front yard of our state capital would have anything to do with it, do you???

Richard230
28 September 2012, 1418
That oil well looks good to me. They need one in front of the CA capital to help balance the budget. :O

Allen_okc
04 October 2012, 0909
Well i called the OTC, Oklahoma Tax Commission at our state capital - this is how it went, after entering 5 different numbers " For The Department Of Motor Vehicles PLEASE enter 3", anyway you get the picture...

i finally got a hold of a actual person, and they told me that it usually takes 4 to 6 weeks, and that Scott the fellow handling it hasnt processed it yet...

Its been two weeks, and probably four more weeks from this date 10-3-2012... it should be snowing by the time i get to legally ride my motorcycle... This Sucks!!!

Richard230
04 October 2012, 1427
Don't you just love the bureaucratic system, Allen? It seems designed to create jobs for government workers and when the jobs are created, the system does everything it can to create the paperwork necessary to keep them permanently occupied and employed. :rolleyes:

Allen_okc
05 October 2012, 0504
i hear ya Richard... well said...

Allen_okc
10 October 2012, 0521
Well here i go again - i received all the paper work back from OTC yesterday - claiming i dont have a receipt for everything on the list that they require to have...

Stuff like;

1.) Engine
2.) Transmission
3.) Gas Tank
4.) Exhaust System

i have a paypal receipt fro everything else...

so its obvious that they didnt understand that this a electric motorcycle, nor do they have a list for EV parts...

so im going to resubmit the request with a detailed description of the bike, and get them to change their policy and add EV's on their list - this maybe a opportunity to get them to get their heads out of big oil's arse, and start thinking that the world is bigger than that...

im pretty sure the photo i submitted gives the impression it is a ICE bike...

billmi
10 October 2012, 0650
It may help in your response letter to explain which items are functionally equivalent for the items they're asking about, that the battery is the equivalent to the gas tank on an internal combustion bike, speed controller the equivalent to a transmission (not really - but it'll help fill in a slot on their form), motor equivalent to engine, etc.

Richard230
10 October 2012, 0734
Gee, Allen, this is getting to be a real struggle. Those guys in Oklahoma just aren't in tune to anything that doesn't run on petroleum distillates. As usual, I wish you luck and hope you can get your bike registered before the state freezes up for the winter.

Allen_okc
10 October 2012, 0815
im going to call them today - i will definitely let you all know how it goes, it just amazes me that these days you think they would be set up for EV's...

Allen_okc
10 October 2012, 0823
i gooder news - i was just told by my bosses here at Metro Sign Corporation, that if i need, they will supply me with a lawyer and are already threatening to go public with this on NEWS channel 4, a section called in your corner, just to wake Oklahoma up and redo their 100 year old policy...

it all matters how this phone call goes, if its bad then we are going to fight for the EV rights to be accepted here...

Allen_okc
10 October 2012, 1050
After the phone call - i talked to @#&% of OTC - even though it wasnt mentioned in his letter, he said the pay pal receipts are okay, but the major components receipts have to be notarized, even the other motorcycle fabricators i talked to said they never had notarize receipts on parts except for the frame...

attached is a photo copy of the list OTC gave me and the letter...

im making this public so others can learn from my mistakes...

Richard230
10 October 2012, 1424
Wow, Oklahoma is really giving you the bureaucratic runaround. And I would ask, to what end? What do they get from having all of that detailed information? It sounds like all they really care about is what the bike is worth so that they can send you a personal property tax bill each year. There must be a better and more efficient way to determine the value of a home-built vehicle. :confused:

billmi
11 October 2012, 0743
i gooder news - i was just told by my bosses here at Metro Sign Corporation, that if i need, they will supply me with a lawyer and are already threatening to go public with this on NEWS channel 4,

Great that they are behind you on this!

Another route to consider is contacting your state or federal congressmen. Most have staffers that help people get through red tape so then can then brag about it in the newsletters they send to their constituents - like how they helped a veteran get benefits they were due. Especially in an election year, the chance to show they are fighting for green technology and protecting citizens from unfair government can be a strong motivator, and they're typically well enough connected to know just who to call to actually make a decision that makes a difference.

Allen_okc
11 October 2012, 0856
Thank You fellows...

at this point im about ready to take my bike to the capital and burn it to the ground right in front of them, with a message that oklahoma is not green friendly, so world can see how belligerent they are...

Hugues
11 October 2012, 0901
Allen,

maybe what i'm gonna say is not what you would like to hear, but i guess the forum is not there only to convince each other of everything we think, so here it is:

i don't think that blowing up this "incident" out of proportion is necessarily the best way to go, it might work, but it might also turn into some kind of hellish lawyers fight.

i don't know where you stand in your discussion with the authority, but if i were you, i would consider meeting them (maybe again) calmly face to face, no lawyers, just you, your bike, and the guy who has decision power in that office, not necessarily the guy behind the desk. I know that 100% of people who are trying EV's come back with a crazy large smile on their face and in an instant forget anything they might have thought about EV's. The EV GRIN.

Have them try your bike, show them the components inside, live, not on paper, give them some invoices, they will need some for their hierarchy, i don't see anything on their letter that must be brought to court for now really, educate them.

i think it's worth another try.

Allen_okc
11 October 2012, 0935
Thank You Hugues - believe it or not i tried that, there is more going on than i can explain into words...

When you walk into the state capital, which is where the OTC office is, you are greeted by a security guard, from there you goto a chair in front of a bullet proof glass where this lady greets you from the other side of the window. the only one you get to talk to is that reception lady and no other - these peoples lifes have been threatened before, "i wonder why", so no one is allowed to be with you face to face...

its all about homeland security here...

the only ones i can do that with is the highway patrol... then there concern is to make sure that no part is from a stolen motorcycle... which my parts are all legit...

the whole thing has been pretty stupid - but im complying with the notarized receipts and will run them through again - if it goes south again, then im going public and with lawyers...

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 0641
:cool: Good news - the state of oklahoma has granted me a new VIN number for my electric motorcycle, as soon as i get the new VIN number stamped into the head stock of the frame, i can take it to the tag agency here and get a new license plate and tag - my insurance will be a 100 hundred dollars a year for liability and thats with GEICO...

So there is a new 2012 fabricated chopper motorcycle born to be free to legally ride on the road...

i also think that it set a new standard for fabricated motorcycles in oklahoma - now they have to ask is it gas or electric...

EVcycle
06 November 2012, 0700
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.


I just took mine officially off the road yesterday.... is this a Yin-Yang thing?

Richard230
06 November 2012, 0814
Congratulations Allen. Perseverance pays off again. It is just too bad that you had to be put through the bureaucratic wringer just to get your bike registered. OK needs to come up with a better system for home-built vehicles. The current system seems to waste everyone's time and to what end?

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 0816
I just took mine officially off the road yesterday.... is this a Yin-Yang thing?


:O NOOOoooo dont do it ED, save yourself!!!

:o i cant wait to get my first speeding ticket, and see how the cop reacts to trying to figuring out what make and model my motorcycle is...

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 0819
Congratulations Allen. Perseverance pays off again. It is just too bad that you had to be put through the bureaucratic wringer just to get your bike registered. OK needs to come up with a better system for home-built vehicles. The current system seems to waste everyone's time and to what end?

im thinking that is the whole point of going the rout i went - to wake oklahoma up and make them realize that their application for IC bikes needs to be changed to IC or EV apps - who knows maybe i made it easier for the next guy that builds there EV motorcycle...

Skeezmour
06 November 2012, 0835
Happy to hear your going to have that great looking cycle on the road Allen.

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 0905
Thank You Skeezmour - i dont care if its snowing, raining or a tornado hits the ground, im riding it as soon as possible...

i'll do a maiden voyage video on its first run home. i intend to take a week vacation that i've been saving just so i can ride it all week long, anywhere and everywhere...

billmi
06 November 2012, 0921
Congratulations Allen!

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 0937
i just want to thank everyone here for helping to make it possible, and a special Thank You to Crazy Ed...

__Tango
06 November 2012, 0958
Congrats man. Great job. I probably would have given up in frustration weeks ago. Grrrr...

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 1147
Thank You Tango - i was begining to wonder if i was ever going to get to ride it - i was even thinking about taking it to the drag strip to play with it, but i still might to see what it will top out at...

EVcycle
06 November 2012, 1214
:O NOOOoooo dont do it ED, save yourself!!!

:o i cant wait to get my first speeding ticket, and see how the cop reacts to trying to figuring out what make and model my motorcycle is...

That's OK, it has been given the gift of the RACE! The way it was meant to be. :)

__Tango
06 November 2012, 1257
Just wondering, if you had registered it first (even in non-running condition), and then gone through the conversion, would you have to re-register it?

In California, once it's registered, i think you can basically do anything to it as long as the frame is the same. Someone mentioned it falls under the same category as putting a carbon fiber hood on a honda civic.

I never verified this personally however...

Allen_okc
06 November 2012, 1500
well the OTC told that he runs into that a lot, he said if he had any suspicion that the bike isnt running yet, he would fail them and to bring in proof it is running...

Allen_okc
09 November 2012, 0811
OK - update - today the motorcycle is going to the motorcycle shop to get the VIN number stamped into the frame, no problem...

the problem is, GEICO is having problems identifying my motorcycle, their not sure what a ASVE motorcycle is, which is the name Oklahoma gave for a Make Name and Model N/A... which i believe the ASVE stands for Assembled Vehicle...

without the insurance i cant get it tagged - im going to try using my insurance company which is State Farm, and see what kind of crap they give me...

Richard230
09 November 2012, 0847
Wow Allen. You sure have a tough time getting off of that vehicle registration merry-go-round. Good luck - again.

I recall one fellow who had an illegal grey-import motorcycle in my county and rode it for many years with a card on the license plate holder that said "License Applied For". As far as I know he never got stopped and got away with the ruse for as long as he owned the bike. Your problem is that you are trying to follow the rules and we all know that doing the right thing is not always the right thing to do. :rolleyes:

Allen_okc
09 November 2012, 0909
i know trying to follow the rules is the hardest rout to go - but this is my way of plowing the road for future builds and future EV builders...

Societies fitting the mold just doesnt work any more, they need to get use to the likes of me and others to follow... there is a definite point to be made here as well as a statement--->

Im not going to take it anymore and im fighting back http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-transport024.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)...

i am winning the battles and i will win the war...

billmi
09 November 2012, 0913
If it's not one thing, it's another. Hang in there!

Allen_okc
09 November 2012, 1021
:cool: i just called State Farm - Approved, $42.77 every six months for liability insurance, another battle won...

Warning State Farms Software does not recognize fabricated vehicle Vin Numbers, they have to call corporate headquarters to enter the information...

Next Battle - The Tag Agency, i win that battle then the war has been won...

Allen_okc
09 November 2012, 1518
Battles Won - The War Is Won... I Win...

guess what im doing tonight???

Richard230
09 November 2012, 1609
Congratulations Allen! :) I hope the weather is nice for your first ride. Now you can write a book (or at least a chapter in Ted's book) detailing how to get an electric conversion licensed in OK.

EVcycle
09 November 2012, 1613
Battles Won - The War Is Won... I Win...

guess what im doing tonight???

Freezing your a$$ off? :) (I guess not, I just checked the weather in Oklahoma City and
it is 77 Deg! - Check local listings)

Congrats!

__Tango
09 November 2012, 1617
woo! Good job man!

SplinterOz
09 November 2012, 1710
Battles Won - The War Is Won... I Win...

guess what im doing tonight???

Allen, congrats.. have fun and take photos and videos!!

Allen_okc
11 November 2012, 1027
Thank You Fellows - first ride home was a blast, the bike rode smooth with plenty of power to spare, the ride to work saturday morning not so good, ran out of juice 3/4 the way there. i had to get the rescue team to come get me, but it sure looked dam good on the side of the road...

it just needs a good charging and some adjustments on the speed controller...

:cool: but i had a EV smile that made my lips hurt...

Allen_okc
12 November 2012, 0640
:cool: Sorry fellows this is the only video i have of that day, but i will definitely get video for ya all...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jP-C72I0GjE&feature=youtu.be

by the way, i still have that silly EV grin on...

__Tango
12 November 2012, 0748
That looks great! Congrats!

Richard230
12 November 2012, 0847
I agree Allen. Your bike really looks great and what you did to enclose the batteries and electrical components was a brilliant styling job. It really looks right on a cruiser. :) All you need now are some "potato, potato" sound effects. :eek:

Allen_okc
12 November 2012, 0920
:confused: potato potato sound effects???

do you have an ideal how to do that... my only thought was to play off a motor sensor... cause i would love a jet turbine sound...

EVcycle
12 November 2012, 1111
Jets and Potato sound....French fries!!!!!

Congrats!

Allen_okc
12 November 2012, 1205
Thank You Ed for getting this project on the right track... i wish you where here to give it a ride, the bike would definitely make you proud...

EVcycle
12 November 2012, 1223
Anytime Daddy-O

It looks very coooool! Now some flame throwers off the back..... ?

Allen_okc
12 November 2012, 1322
i considering rocket launchers mounted to the bike - i pitty the fool that pulls out in front of me...

billmi
13 November 2012, 0820
Back around 1984, it was this illustration, from a gaming magazine that convinced me I wanted to build an electric motorcycle one day.

http://www.sjgames.com/car-wars/adq/3/3/motorcycle.html

http://www.sjgames.com/car-wars/adq/3/3/bike.gif

Items 18 and 19 are the flamethrower, oil slick generator and smoke generators.

Also note the hydraulic drive train instead of a chain, shaft or belt. Variable pitch impeller blades in the system allow for an infinitely variable gear ratio.

Allen_okc
13 November 2012, 1030
:rolleyes: flame throwers OK, what about a RPG and Gatling Gun, :D something to move traffic in a hurry...

:rolleyes: thats the good news, :( the bad news is;

i blew my battery pack - yeah its my fault, but it will be fixed and up an running this weekend - wish i could say whats wrong with it, but im not sure...

charging port number 1 - positive 27.2 volts

charging port number 2 - positive 27.2 volts

charging port number 3 - negative 30 volts, you can say its impossible, but thats what its reading...

that was with the controller connected, now the controller is disconnected, port 3 showing positive 12 volts now... which means i blew a cell last saturday or i lost connectivity with one of the bus bars... anyway battery pack is going to be disassembled and each cell checked and tested and reassembled...

i'll know more by friday, im taking three days off to fix the problem so i can ride it again by Thanksgiving...

:cool: while im at it, i think i'll install the rocket launcher...

Richard230
13 November 2012, 1424
Allen, did Lucas make your batteries? :O

Allen_okc
13 November 2012, 1512
either Lucas or Murphy - alright i cant blame them, it was ME ME ME, I DID IT, I TOUCHED IT, I BROKE THE LITTLE CELL, im so ashamed, but it sure was a kick arse ride...

im still grinning from the ride Friday - superman couldnt stop me from riding it again...

:cool: the chopper will ride again...