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View Full Version : 4 more Elcon 1500 chargers for sale on Ebay - New - $340 each



furyphoto
13 December 2014, 1320
The same guy who I bought two Elcon 1500's from last week also has 4 new in box ones for sale at $340 each.

I'm not affiliated with this guy other than I bought two used chargers from him. But, these are almost half price compared to a new charger.

They are programmed with algorithm 512v (http://www.electricsubaru.com/charging/Elcon%20Algorithms500.png) with 10 settings from 58.4v to 91.25v

6134

A pretty good deal for anyone who can work within that programming.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ElCon-PFC-1500-EV-Electric-Vehicle-Lithium-Battery-Charger-72V-Nominal-60-90V-/251752154376

Stevo
14 December 2014, 1025
Warning: The voltages are not accurate. I was going to buy one for the low end to use with 7 Leaf modules, and he checked output at the lowest setting, and metered at almost 65 volts. Definitely a good deal for 72 volt systems.

4dollarjoe
14 December 2014, 1811
Awesome, so this will this work with 8 leaf modules in a 60v pack, right? What if the voltage is only 65v?

furyphoto
14 December 2014, 2121
Warning: The voltages are not accurate. I was going to buy one for the low end to use with 7 Leaf modules, and he checked output at the lowest setting, and metered at almost 65 volts. Definitely a good deal for 72 volt systems.

Do you know if he tested it under load? My understanding is that you can't get an accurate read on the final CV (Constant Voltage) stage of the charge until it is actually at the top of the charge. It's possible the CC (constant current) voltage might be a bit more than the final pack voltage, and the charger ramps it down to the programmed voltage for the CV phase as the pack approaches the target voltage at the end of the charge.

I have always heard that Elcon were quite good chargers, so I can't imagine them being that far out. Charging a 58.4v pack to 65v could cause significant damage. I can't see Elcons having such a good reputation if they were that inaccurate.

Maybe there is someone who is using an Elcon that could provide some more insight.

Stevo
14 December 2014, 2126
He said he tested it on a 48 v bank of Pb-acid batts

furyphoto
14 December 2014, 2136
Awesome, so this will this work with 8 leaf modules in a 60v pack, right? What if the voltage is only 65v?

There is a thread on DIYElectricCar (http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51100) about how to do a modification to be able to fine tune the final charger voltage. You have to add one resistor, and one Potentiometer. There is a small bit of math involved to determine the value of the components. It basically allows you to adjust the charger feedback, so it is reading a "false voltage" adjusted by you to convince the charger to push a bit higher CV level to finish the charger. The Can Bus versions of the Elcons work this way, constantly asking the BMS how much voltage to push. With the mod on the Non-CANbus (programmed) versions, you are tricking the charger to think it isn't at the target voltage yet, so to turn up the juice a bit.

I plan on making this mod to my chargers so I can set the charge voltage exactly as I want it. (90v in my particular case)

Just to clarify again, I'm not endorsing this seller (my experience was good), or the chargers, I just think it is a good deal for builders in the target voltage range.

4dollarjoe
15 December 2014, 1628
what are the negative effects of charging your pack slightly off or at a lower voltage? Can the bms prevent the overcharging effects?

Not sure if I feel confident enough to do the mod. Do you think a bms could protect my pack regardless?

I could hit three on the selector and get a 65.70v max, close to the 67.2v of my pack. Issue is this algorithm is programmed to cells that are 3.65v when mine are 4.2v, will this really make a difference?

furyphoto
15 December 2014, 2103
what are the negative effects of charging your pack slightly off or at a lower voltage? Can the bms prevent the overcharging effects?

Not sure if I feel confident enough to do the mod. Do you think a bms could protect my pack regardless?

I could hit three on the selector and get a 65.70v max, close to the 67.2v of my pack. Issue is this algorithm is programmed to cells that are 3.65v when mine are 4.2v, will this really make a difference?


It's generally agreed that slightly undercharging your batteries is not harmful, and can actually be a good way to protect your batteries and extend cycle life. If you look around the EV forums, you will see that people are regularly charging to 4.1 or 4.15v instead of charging all the way to the top at 4.2v.

By undercharging a bit, you lose a small % from your range, but you are being much more friendly to your batteries. (that is assuming you don't run them too low when you are riding!)

If you look at the charge and discharges curve for the Leaf cells, you can see there is not much power above 4.1v, and hardly any at all above 4.15v.

http://architecturalphotographers.com/_Services/proofs/ElMoto/LeafBatts_04.jpg


http://architecturalphotographers.com/_Services/proofs/ElMoto/LeafBatts_05.jpg


I will be charging mine to a voltage where they settle at 90v, so right about 4.09v per cell. I haven't tested for voltage settling from a full charge, so I may charge a tiny bit higher if the cells don't hold their exact charge voltage. I need a pack that is ideally at 89.99999 volts for my controller to get the most out of the pack.


65.7v would be 4.106v per cell if you have 8 modules, so it could be a reasonable working voltage for charging that pack.

These (non Can bus) Elcons are supposed to have an enable on a couple of the 7pin connector pins, that can be managed by a BMS or relay. If you look here (http://lithiumate.elithion.com/php/elcon.php) you will see that connecting pin 1 and 3 enables the charger, and disconnecting it disables the charger in theory. So potentially a BMS that was monitoring cell voltages could disable the charger when a certain pack voltage is reached. The only problem is that would likely happen before the CV phase, I don't know how much effect that would have on obtaining a "full" charge or if it's actually a problem. Voltages might not settle evenly with out the low amp constant voltage phase of the charging.
Tuning the end voltage with the modification would be better. You could always send the charger to Elcon in California and have it reprogrammed too, but the cost might make it just as worthwhile to buy one from the factory. Depends on where you live I suppose. That's cost prohibitive for me in Canada.

The charger only sees the full pack voltage, so it doesn't know what type of cells you have. It shouldn't matter, the charger will charge to the full pack voltage of the setting you use. You just have to determine the program you use based on the end voltage, not the cell count on the label.