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Thread: USA Leaf owner wants to convert Derbi supermotard

              
   
   
  1. #11
    Senior Member Stevo's Avatar
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    Welcome to the challenge! LOL
    Battery space is the main issue for all of us DIY'ers. You can look at other batt types. I'm not particularly fond of Tesla batteries...its like wiring a bunch of double AA's together!! LOL! And then making a BMS for all those little batteries will be a nightmare.
    Current rides: '96 Honda Ohlins VFR, '03 Cannondale C440R, '03 Cannondale Cannibal, '06 Yamaha 450 Wolverine 4x4
    Current builds: http://elmoto.net/showthread.php?t=4354

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevo View Post
    which is why I suggested opening up the modules with a can opener....
    Before you think(or suggest!) of doing this, watch this dufus with a machete:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcqaAz1vjlo

  3. #13
    Senior Member Stevo's Avatar
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    I've seen his videos! but it's still doable and others have successfully done it. I have NOT personally tried it, but am thinking about it as I have retired a bunch of Leaf modules....
    or I may use them to build my own Power Wall charged by an array of 5x 200watt solar panels to charge my bike's pack. I have a lot to learn about solar installation so I was planning on starting a thread to ask for tips when I get closer to beginning this project. I'm not sure what it would take to safely use a bank of 13 x ~50aHr Leaf modules at ~106v to charge a 96v pack of 24x 75 aHr Kokams
    Last edited by Stevo; 11 March 2018 at 1728.
    Current rides: '96 Honda Ohlins VFR, '03 Cannondale C440R, '03 Cannondale Cannibal, '06 Yamaha 450 Wolverine 4x4
    Current builds: http://elmoto.net/showthread.php?t=4354

  4. #14
    Senior Member T Rush's Avatar
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    I'd like to try making the Leaf modules look cool ... still in their cans, at weird angles and stuff
    ....so far I've mostly seen them used in block stacks, crude and boring

  5. #15
    Senior Member Stevo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T Rush View Post
    I'd like to try making the Leaf modules look cool ... still in their cans, at weird angles and stuff
    ....so far I've mostly seen them used in block stacks, crude and boring
    Big cans of anchovies!
    Current rides: '96 Honda Ohlins VFR, '03 Cannondale C440R, '03 Cannondale Cannibal, '06 Yamaha 450 Wolverine 4x4
    Current builds: http://elmoto.net/showthread.php?t=4354

  6. #16
    Senior Member T Rush's Avatar
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    ok, pulled all the ICE guts out of the bike today....I've had the bike mostly stripped down for awhile(headlight, seat, fairings, forks, bars, wheels off) so only had to remove the fuel tank and air box, and was able to take the engine out still connected to everything; dash gauges, radiator, wiring harness, coil, rectifier, horn, twist throttle, etc. everything in one piece!(thought that might be better than labeling everything to know what connected to what, and losing parts)....I had the perfect chunks of styrofoam laying around(the right thickness) so was ready to cut them to battery module sized, and then I put the bare frame up on a rolling cart to test the looks with fairings and seat....that put me into 'sit and look at it' mode(which my shop assistant loves, as she gets lap time then) so I never got the foam cut for mockups yet

    I'll start a build thread soon....but now I'm committed to this

    image.jpgimage.jpg
    Last edited by T Rush; 13 March 2018 at 0128. Reason: added photos from my phone

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  8. #17
    Senior Member Spaceweasel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T Rush View Post
    so only had to remove the fuel tank and air box, and was able to take the engine out still connected to everything; dash gauges, radiator, wiring harness, coil, rectifier, horn, twist throttle, etc. everything in one piece!

    image.jpgimage.jpg
    I'm always amazed at how much ~stuff~ comes out of an ICE conversion. The straightforwardness of an EV is one of the things that attracts me to it.

  9. #18
    Senior Member Stevo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceweasel View Post
    I'm always amazed at how much ~stuff~ comes out of an ICE conversion. The straightforwardness of an EV is one of the things that attracts me to it.
    Until you go water cooled, and then start adding more ~stuff~ back!
    Current rides: '96 Honda Ohlins VFR, '03 Cannondale C440R, '03 Cannondale Cannibal, '06 Yamaha 450 Wolverine 4x4
    Current builds: http://elmoto.net/showthread.php?t=4354

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  11. #19
    Senior Member T Rush's Avatar
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    put all that ~stuff~ in a box today, was gonna bring it home and weigh it, but I think I'll just sneak my Wife's bathroom scale over to the shop tomorrow
    ...did spend a little time seeing how many parts I forgot it had that I'd taken off before, and rounding them all up again

    already did a major upgrade to my first design
    ...my shop assistant wasn't happy with the rickety cart I had it sitting on, so I U-bolted it to the base of one of my Wife's old office chairs
    now its slightly height and tilt adjustable, plus freely rotates...strange how my Wife thought I should have thrown that away years ago...tho the casters dont roll well at all

    cut a few module mock-ups(I made them slightly larger @ 12"X9"X1" so when I get real Nissan Leaf battery modules I'll have extra wiggle room)
    ....the plan is to get it to a stage where I know what I want, what can be done, what parts I'll need...and then find a good place for it to sit till I sell my Suzuki bike and/or boat https://iowacity.craigslist.org/mcy/...513088124.html while I get our Big Boat ready to go out to the marina this spring

    tried quite a few different arrangements of the modules; like stacking but some going flat across, and others going forward n back, as I'll need some offset to run a larger pulley on one side of the cross-shaft over to a small front drive chain sprocket(remember the motor has to mount up high under the seat behind the mono shock to get the modules in the frame at all) this 'stair stepping' was kinda wide, I tried wide at the top going down narrower, and also wide at the bottom to get the weight down as low as possible...this gave me the most 'normal' installation, so I didn't like it(and it would be impossible to thru bolt the modules together)
    finally found the strangest way to do it...I used some pencils to stab thru where the bolt holes will be, and connected the modules askew....thinking I'll get some short pieces of rope and see how crazy I can make the serial connections between them(but I'm hoping to cold forge some copper rod vs messing with crimping ends on a bunch of heavy gauge cable) with this placement; one module is directly in line with the center down tube, next ones on either side of it are fully still in-between the twin spars of the frame but rotated out of the way of where the pulley down from the motor and the drive sprocket will be, the last layer kinda is in line with the frame spars; but this gives me five modules down the lowest as possible...then another two go up where the radiator shrouds are on either sides and the last two back on the sides under the rear fender shroud bodywork...so 9 will fit, also this leaves a large storage spot in the center of the frame up high(carry an extension cord around?), with room under the seat for controller and other ~el.stuff~....the charger will go up where the radiator was(for good cooling while riding? eh?)

    I really will start another build thread for this, as soon as I can act like I know what I'm doing

    image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpg
    Last edited by T Rush; 14 March 2018 at 0405. Reason: added photos

  12. #20
    Senior Member T Rush's Avatar
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    still trying to figure out some ~el.stuff~

    first

    so if I have a 9 Leaf battery pack, lets say its 72v 60ah; and I charge it with a 1000watt 72volt Delta Q QuiQ, it would take ~5 hours?
    battery is 72volts X 60amps X 1hour = 4320watts @ 1 hour
    charger is 72volts X 14amps = 1000watts (or something like that...maybe even they are 20amps 1500watts?)
    time is 4320 / 1000 = 4.4 hours(loosely) ?
    ...just really kinda checking if thats how ya do the maths...charging in 3 to 5 hours depending on how drained they are sounds great

    next question

    I removed at least 55lbs of ICE ~stuff~ but I'm gonna add around 100lbs of ~el.stuff~ or more(batteries, charger, motor, big wires, controller, and etc. is gonna add up fast)....so the final weight of the el.motorcycle will go from 216lbs(original as manufactured) to 250lbs maybe even closer to 300lbs
    ...so I was looking at the 3kw(6kw peak) HPM3000B GoldenMotor(thinking 'keep costs low, then upgrade latter if needed'); but the 'fun' bikes running these little 3kw motors all look to weigh well under 200lbs, so maybe that motor isn't right for my build, and I'll want something more powerful right away...if its only say $200 or so more(which isn't a large % of the total build price investment) I would think I'd be better off starting out with a few more kw
    ...ok then, as an example(I'm still looking at anything else tho) would I be 'glad that I did' if I went with the 72V 5KW HPM5000B ?
    https://www.goldenmotor.com/frame-bldcmotor.htm
    ...seems like I'll have a pretty big battery pack, so even at almost 5kw constant use, I might still get close to an hour run time?

    last

    I did some more 'mocking up and about' of the Derbi
    ...with where the motor has to go(higher up under the seat, just rear of the mono shock) to fit the Leaf modules in the frame at all, the pulley system from the motor down to the cross-shaft/drive-sprocket has to run 'around' the swing arm thru axle, and the motor is limited to only being 5"-6" wide to fit inside the rear sub-frame with the top motor end pulley needing to be inline inside the swing-arm(where the drive-sprocket end of the cross-shaft actually is right on top|under the swing-arm directly inline with the pivot, ya know same placement where the ICE trans had it)...so I was kinda thinking I wanted to run a belt vs chain on the motor to "jack-shaft"(is that what they call a cross-shaft?) on the pulley wheels, and mess with different sizes of these motor and jack-shaft pulley wheels to get my final drive ratio
    ...so can I take out the swing arm 'axle'(this was the main thing the ICE mounted too as well) and just use two bolts on the swing-arm pivots? or is that a big 'no no' with motorcycle design?
    as if I'm changing pulley wheel sizes all the time, it might be nice to change belts too(and not have to take half the bike apart to do it) AND one of the big benefits would be the larger bottom pulley on the jack-shaft would not hit that pivot axle, and maybe slide it further outboard... hmmm


    [editing in a few more photos]
    stuck a few more parts on...I'm really happy how everything is looking like it'll fit together(I know in these photos its hard to see...and I guess I didn't take shots with the rear battery module mock ups under those back side finder shroud things)...the only issue thats kinda awkward; is that I'll have to change/remove/rebuild the back of the front fender, as it might hit the front modules and the charger will need alittle more space
    image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpg
    I'll retake some better photos for a real build thread
    Last edited by T Rush; 15 March 2018 at 2136. Reason: everyone loves more pictures

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