Power in Flux
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Thread: 1980 Kawasaki 440 LTD 8kW conversion

              
   
   
  1. #71
    Member Functional Artist's Avatar
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    Chapter 2
    Upgrading to 48V

    I reconfigured the battery cables to include the 4th battery
    (now, we have all 4 12V 35AH batteries "wired" in series to provide us with a 48V 35AH battery pack)
    ...added some rubber "boots" over all of the battery terminals (for safety & it looks better
    ...& switched the 36V contactor with the "new" 48V contactor

    Here is a video testing the 48V set up
    …with some nice, up close footage of the "drive train" (in action)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBU6...kE7RowDoBCsuCh
    IP

  2. #72
    Empulse R #24 frodus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Functional Artist View Post
    I have never heard of Mike Corbin
    THE ELECTRIC GARAGE: THE CORBIN “QUICKSILVER”
    November 23, 2013 by Ted Dillard in History, The Electric Garage

    In 1974 Mike Corbin set the Electric Motorcycle Land Speed Record at Bonneville with “Quicksilver”- a bike that, in 1972 set the previous Land Speed Record running lead/acid batteries. The 1974 record of 165.397MPH stood for over 30 years. There aren’t many photos, but here’s what I’ve got:






    The bike was running silver-zinc batteries (thus the name). Now, you may have never heard of silver-zinc chemistry, or you may think it’s a long-lost ancestor of the current lithium battery we all run today. Well, you’d be wrong. Silver-zinc is a well known chemistry, it’s still in use, and to find the poster child for sliver-zinc chemistry you’d have to go to outer space. Mars, to be precise. Yeah, we’re talking the batteries in the Mars “Curiosity” Rover, and yes, Yardney is still around.

    Take a look at their website, here. Yardney is into lithium chemistry too, but look at these numbers for silver-zinc, here, on their datasheet. Here’s what jumps out: Wh/lb ratings of anywhere from 43 to 69. For reference, an average LiFePO4 prismatic cell is around 30-35 Wh/lb. Back in ’74, they represented a 8x “more available power” advantage over lead.

    Here are the specs I could get:

    Silver Zinc Batts by Yardney
    System Voltage: 120 v , 1200 amps
    Charged with industrial off board charger
    Motors, starter motors from A-4 fighter plane, bought military surplus. Intermittent duty, Series wound DC , silver conductors
    LOA: 9’6″
    Weight: 772lbs (935 lbs with rider)
    Oh, the controller? How about this:

    Three stage magnetic contractors , with a spring loaded giant knife switch for shut off. A 250A fuse in parallel bought time for knife to clear without arc. The magnetics could not survive the opening arc.
    To which I responded, “holy shit”. To which Mike responded, “That’s what I said…”

    The bike was the first electric vehicle raced with battery technology beyond simple lead/acid.

    For a pretty complete picture of what Corbin was doing in the mid-seventies, see my post here. It talks a bit about the batteries there too. I also did a post on the Corbin motorcycles here, after seeing one of the bikes at the Springfield Museums. A pretty complete history of Mike and his work with electric vehicles, starting with an electric minibike can be found here- Keep Your Eye on the Sparrow.

    You can see the bike, today, in person, at the Small Wonders Microcar Museum, in in Crystal Lake, IL.

    …and yeah. I’m a bit of a Corbin groupie.

    IP

  3. #73
    Member Functional Artist's Avatar
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    Wow! Very Kool!

    Thank you, for the good/positive (+) reply

    Interesting & helpful information
    ...without any disparaging remarks
    IP

  4. #74
    Member Functional Artist's Avatar
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    Now that the propulsion system is functional @ 48V
    ...we gotta get the 12V system powered (up)

    I don't want to add another 12V battery just to power/run the accessories
    …& I don't want to draw 12V off (1) of the (4) batteries in the battery pack (it would cause the pack to become "unbalanced")

    So, I got a (48V to 12V) DC to DC converter (~$17.00)
    ...like they use for putting lights & stereos on golf carts

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/48V-VOLTAGE...EAAOSwsCFZoXEr

    Here is a quick video on gettin' the DC to DC hooked up

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVK-...CsuCh&index=30
    IP

  5. #75
    Empulse R #24 frodus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Functional Artist View Post
    Wow! Very Kool!

    Thank you, for the good/positive (+) reply

    Interesting & helpful information
    ...without any disparaging remarks
    I've just kept it to myself is all. Let me share some of my thoughts:

    - Cool project. Most of us here have at least started where you are. It's awesome you're trying to create something new and that you've found this hobby. It's a kick in the pants.

    - It seems like you've done some of your own research. I do think that you should welcome more comments and opinions as a way to learn and develop your projects. You don't know everything. Neither do we, but we have a lot of tribal knowledge and it's a goldmine in a forum like this.

    - Your writing style is unique, to say the least. I think I speak for everyone here when I say, it's very difficult to read, and very hard to follow. Maybe try to put things into a structure of paragraphs that are a little easier for the general public to read.

    - You're not very willing to take any sort of criticism, and I saw this on the DIY Electric Car forum as well. It would be good if you learned to take some criticism in a more positive way. There's dozens of ways to do something, and many of the forum members, myself and Ted included, have been doing this for many years and have multiple projects under our belt. We're sharing information that might keep you from going down a path that wastes your time, money and energy. Don't fault us for sharing an alternate view on how something can be done.

    - You're as guilty as we are of not reading everything. On multiple occasions you've not read people's comments. Realize that, no one (not even you) has time to read every word of every thread from every member. I seriously doubt anyone has read all of my posts (or yours for that matter) from start to finish. Please don't get upset because someone didn't pick up on a small detail in post 21 on page 3 of your 5 page project thread. Just repeat the detail we missed and move on.

    - Your posts are in a randomized order of historic chronology. It's a bit like watching the movie "Memento" where the scenes are out of order. That may be your style, but it ain't for everyone, and I find it's hard to track the current state of your project when you keep switching from 2017 to 2018.

    - You're not making many friends on here due to your reactions. Don't ask longtime members "who the **** do you think you are" and expect a positive response. You're the new guy on a forum full of longtime members that have converted multiple projects going back to maybe 2007. We know a lot about this technology and have been around since before there was an electric motorcycle forum, and before Zero and Brammo even existed. Please respect that.

    - Ted not only wrote a book, but he's converted a handful of vehicles and has established a maker-space in his homedown for others to build and learn. He's done a lot to not only share knowledge, but also nurture people's urge to build and learn by creating a space and adding tools they can use.

    - I didn't particularly like Ted over the years. He's a jerk sometimes, and he may be hard headed, but we all are. You've resembled that lately too. Lighten up and learn to let things roll off the sleeve.

    - I can't watch your videos, as they make me motion sick. Please try to hold the camera steady or get a tripod.
    IP

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  7. #76
    Administrator ElMotoMike's Avatar
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    Functional Artist has been banned for 7 days. I thank the members of the community who notified me of this person's antics. Should Functional Artist persist in the future, please let me know and the ban will become permanent.
    - Mike
    IP

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  9. #77
    Senior Member Ted Dillard's Avatar
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    Just stopped in for a bit to clean up some of my stuff and saw this... awwww, Travvy. You're too kind. (actually, 2 books on electric motorcycles... 6 published books in all. ...and I used to think you were a jerk too. )

    Quote Originally Posted by Functional Artist View Post
    Wow! Very Kool!

    Interesting & helpful information
    Thanks, glad you enjoyed that. That was some of the reference/source material/notes I used for Power in Flux. There's more about Mike and his accomplishments in the book. Mike Corbin is in the AMA Hall of Fame, and held that record for 30 years. Great guy, still working hard, and yes, the owner of Corbin Saddles, and we're still in touch. Thanks for posting that Travis, and for the record, that's all copyrighted, including the photos, please.

    Mike, where're the "Posting Rules" or whatever? I know we have them, I couldn't find them when I looked.

    Finally, when FA comes back, yes, I edit my posts a lot. It's one of the tools of good writing and effective communication.

    (edit: just saw that Lulu is offering 15% off the book until Aug 30. Use this code: FIFTEEN)
    Last edited by Ted Dillard; 3 Weeks Ago at 0314.
    Power in Flux: The History of Electric Motorcycles
    www.powerinflux.com
    IP

  10. #78
    Senior Member Ted Dillard's Avatar
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    Ah, found them... They only show up when you go to register a new user:

    Forum Rules

    Registration to this forum is free! We do insist that you abide by the rules and policies detailed below. If you agree to the terms, please check the 'I agree' checkbox and press the 'Complete Registration' button below. If you would like to cancel the registration, click here to return to the forums index.

    Although the administrators and moderators of ElMoto.net - the electric motorcycle forum will attempt to keep all objectionable messages off this site, it is impossible for us to review all messages. All messages express the views of the author, and neither the owners of ElMoto.net - the electric motorcycle forum, nor vBulletin Solutions Inc. (developers of vBulletin) will be held responsible for the content of any message.

    By agreeing to these rules, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.

    The owners of ElMoto.net - the electric motorcycle forum reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any content item for any reason.


    Maybe it'd be good to post them somewhere more accessible?
    Power in Flux: The History of Electric Motorcycles
    www.powerinflux.com
    IP

  11. #79
    Senior Member Nicman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frodus View Post
    I've just kept it to myself is all. Let me share some of my thoughts:

    - Cool project. Most of us here have at least started where you are. It's awesome you're trying to create something new and that you've found this hobby. It's a kick in the pants.

    - It seems like you've done some of your own research. I do think that you should welcome more comments and opinions as a way to learn and develop your projects. You don't know everything. Neither do we, but we have a lot of tribal knowledge and it's a goldmine in a forum like this.

    - Your writing style is unique, to say the least. I think I speak for everyone here when I say, it's very difficult to read, and very hard to follow. Maybe try to put things into a structure of paragraphs that are a little easier for the general public to read.

    - You're not very willing to take any sort of criticism, and I saw this on the DIY Electric Car forum as well. It would be good if you learned to take some criticism in a more positive way. There's dozens of ways to do something, and many of the forum members, myself and Ted included, have been doing this for many years and have multiple projects under our belt. We're sharing information that might keep you from going down a path that wastes your time, money and energy. Don't fault us for sharing an alternate view on how something can be done.

    - You're as guilty as we are of not reading everything. On multiple occasions you've not read people's comments. Realize that, no one (not even you) has time to read every word of every thread from every member. I seriously doubt anyone has read all of my posts (or yours for that matter) from start to finish. Please don't get upset because someone didn't pick up on a small detail in post 21 on page 3 of your 5 page project thread. Just repeat the detail we missed and move on.

    - Your posts are in a randomized order of historic chronology. It's a bit like watching the movie "Memento" where the scenes are out of order. That may be your style, but it ain't for everyone, and I find it's hard to track the current state of your project when you keep switching from 2017 to 2018.

    - You're not making many friends on here due to your reactions. Don't ask longtime members "who the **** do you think you are" and expect a positive response. You're the new guy on a forum full of longtime members that have converted multiple projects going back to maybe 2007. We know a lot about this technology and have been around since before there was an electric motorcycle forum, and before Zero and Brammo even existed. Please respect that.

    - Ted not only wrote a book, but he's converted a handful of vehicles and has established a maker-space in his homedown for others to build and learn. He's done a lot to not only share knowledge, but also nurture people's urge to build and learn by creating a space and adding tools they can use.

    - I didn't particularly like Ted over the years. He's a jerk sometimes, and he may be hard headed, but we all are. You've resembled that lately too. Lighten up and learn to let things roll off the sleeve.

    - I can't watch your videos, as they make me motion sick. Please try to hold the camera steady or get a tripod.
    I've been away from elmoto too long. This accurately describes the reason why I think I have taken a break.

    Ive found that the people who contribute to this forum have always been helpful, patient and have challenged me to learn as much as I can before I even post. I remember that this was the first forum I have ever posted on and I'm so glad I did.

    The connections I've made have really opened my eyes to the changes in our culture and values about the ecosystem that we all share.

    Anyway, that's just a crazy tangent. I just wanted to do more than just like a post. Not the same effect


    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
    IP

  12. Likes Ted Dillard, frodus, ZoomSmith liked this post
  13. #80
    Member Functional Artist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Dillard View Post
    Ah, found them... They only show up when you go to register a new user:

    Forum Rules

    Registration to this forum is free! We do insist that you abide by the rules and policies detailed below. If you agree to the terms, please check the 'I agree' checkbox and press the 'Complete Registration' button below. If you would like to cancel the registration, click here to return to the forums index.

    Although the administrators and moderators of ElMoto.net - the electric motorcycle forum will attempt to keep all objectionable messages off this site, it is impossible for us to review all messages. All messages express the views of the author, and neither the owners of ElMoto.net - the electric motorcycle forum, nor vBulletin Solutions Inc. (developers of vBulletin) will be held responsible for the content of any message.

    By agreeing to these rules, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.

    The owners of ElMoto.net - the electric motorcycle forum reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any content item for any reason.


    Maybe it'd be good to post them somewhere more accessible?
    Wow! You went & told on me?
    …& got me banned?

    "All messages express the views of the author"
    ...I was expressing "my views/opinions"
    ...in "my thread"
    …& I did not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.

    I asked my oldest daughter to read over this entire thread
    ...to get a neutral opinion

    She says your jelly
    ...R U jelly?
    IP

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