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Thread: New Member, want to start a Kymco Spade Conversion.

              
   
   
  1. #1
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    New Member, want to start a Kymco Spade Conversion.

    Hey all.

    Been an avid fan of electric since I was a kid. Sold my Zero SR recently, but I still want an electric bike. I want to convert my kymco for some fun around town.

    It's a little 150cc motorcycle. It's great as is, but shifting is a drag after riding the zero for so long.
    21034639_1807909035892919_5804705228530878565_n.jpg

    I could really use advice on picking components. I would like it to be as powerful if not more than stock. (12.5hp @8500 RPM 8ft-lb @7000rpm) But I also want to keep the cost down as much ass possible. I'm not looking to make the grom-reaper or anything. Not a freeway bike, but targeting 60mph as a max speed just so I can keep up with traffic on the 40mph roads around me would be nice, but it does not need to sustain that speed.

    I want to fabricate it in a way where everything bolts on and I can return to stock if I choose. This should be pretty straightforward with the way the ICE mounts to the bike.

    The Kymco gets it's speedo and odo straight from the rear wheel, so I plan on leaving the stock instrument cluster and just adding a small voltage display for monitoring the battery.

    I'm been looking at parts from monenergy, kelly, goldemnotor, etc and it's really hard to know what's actually going to be worth my money and what would be overkill for this project.

    Most recently I've been fixated on this kit from denzel. Seems like it should be powerful enough for my goals, and the price for everything they include in the kit is hard to beat.

    As for the battery, I was aiming for 72v, building it myself. Not 100% sure which cells I will use. I plan on building the battery after everything else is mounted and ready, this way I can maximize the batteries shape and size.

    Any input is appreciated!

  2. #2
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    Looks like an idea candidate for a hub motor based on that usage profile.
    Simple, costs effective and space efficient.

    Biothunder has a well documented spec here for his effort which will provide you with links to the sort of components that you're after: http://elmoto.net/showthread.php?t=5195

    There are literally dozens of ways you could go about this though, so the above is just to provide you with a baseline to tailor from.

  3. #3
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    Thanks for the response.

    I'm not totally against it, but for a few reasons I'm trying to avoid a hub motor. I'm not too concerned about the typical unsprung weight complaint, but one of my main goals is to keep the build simple and bolt-on.

    Looking through Biothunders thread and images confirms some challenges that I'm not really interested in taking on for this particular project. Needing to possibly have a custom swingarm mount for the right caliper and bracket and then modify and weld the bracket onto the swingarm, etc all adds complexity to a project that I ultimately want to keep as simple as possible.

    Mounting a mid-drive motor seems much more straightforward to me, even if it digs into my battery space. Mid-drive would allow me to leave my stock brakes and structure entirely in place.

    I took some measurements, and assuming the mid-drive motor has an 8" diameter, I would easily still have space for a 3KWH pack out of salvaged model 3 cells. Which should be plenty for me.

  4. #4
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    As I said, just a baseline to tailor from.

    A centralised motor is definitely the better way to go for higher performance, but there's little benefit to it beyond that IMO.

    Consider that you're concerned about making a bolt on bracket for a caliper; and then consider that to mount a motor inboard you're going to have to fabricate custom motor mounts at the least.
    You're also going to need to build a battery cage, mount a controller, fit a wiring loom and come up with a charging solution - so if a small bracket on the back wheel is causing you concern then you may want to reconsider doing this to begin with.

    There is no 'bolt in' solution - these projects require fabrication, there's no way around that I'm afraid.

  5. #5
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    Maybe my wording wasn't great. It's not that fabrication bothers me. Of course I will have to do plenty of fabrication, from the motor mount to the battery box to the battery itself. I do appreciate the link to that thread though, it's one of the better documented conversions I've seen.

    But I want what I fabricate to bolt to the existing frame without modifying it. It's not that mounting a caliper bracket or modifying the swing arm is difficult, it's that it requires modification of the swingarm, which I want to avoid. I want to keep the bike as close to stock as possible aside from the necessary drivetrain components.

    I did do a little research on possible hub motors, but it seems like more trouble than its worth just to space and sacrifice performance. The only hub motor manufacturer I could find that would match the 12 x 3.5 wheels on my spade is QS motors, but their standard configurations of this size are meant for scooters with more narrow swingarms. So again, I'd either need a whole new swingarm or have to custom order the motor itself. It also seems as though shipping from QS is a big unknown right now. Most of the listings for their parts on aliexpress straight up say will not ship to the US, and it seems that the timeline for stuff that will ship is entirely unknown.

    The more I think about this project the more power I want, it seems. I'm now looking at the ME1718. Lots of power in a compact size.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Stevo's Avatar
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    Just remove the swingarm, wheel and components and store them to put back on. You can find a swingarm that will fit and modify the new replacement one that you find, as long as you dont have to modify the frame too much. I suspect that you will have to do some welding/modifying to the frame, but that can probably be done so you can revert back to original easily enough.
    Last edited by Stevo; 27 November 2020 at 1319.
    Current rides: '96 Honda Ohlins VFR, '03 Cannondale C440R, '03 Cannondale Cannibal, '06 Yamaha 450 Wolverine 4x4
    Current builds: eVOR.v3.4
    WORX.VOR.v3.2

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    That's fair, getting another swingarm isn't a big deal. It seems to me like QSmotor is the only real source for these types of hub motors, or am I missing something?

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    Quote Originally Posted by caza View Post
    That's fair, getting another swingarm isn't a big deal. It seems to me like QSmotor is the only real source for these types of hub motors, or am I missing something?
    I have found http://www.evalbum.com/ to be a good reference for what other people have used. There are a lot of motorcycles on there and you can filter things to see what you're looking for.

    QS is a good source, but if you want something made in the states, enertrac makes some hub motors.
    https://www.enertrac.net/product.php
    I'm not sure what they're doing right now amidst the pandemic, but other than that, despite their website looking super old and shady, they are pretty legit. If you look around on youtube you can find some videos of people using their motors.

    They are more expensive than QS motor, but they're made in USA (I think... It's a US company anyway)
    They also offer water cooling.
    (QS does too but it's way too expensive)

    Other than that, if you're looking purely for cost effectiveness, QS just released their 6kw continuous (10kw peak claimed) mid drive kits.
    https://a.aliexpress.com/_mKPEYhT
    Looks like just under 600 before shipping.

    I'm not affiliated with them at all, and I can't vouch for anything they make at all except that my 12kw hub motor does indeed power up.
    (And split my wood stand you can see in my video link in the forum when I twisted the throttle too quickly...)
    I have not gotten to test anything under load yet.

    So far I'm super happy with it but just don't think I'm some kind of QS motor expert.
    I've just looked around at a lot of stuff.

    For what it's worth, I do plan on doing another build after my current one, and I will most likely be moving to a mid-drive motor.

    I don't regret getting the hub motor, but a mid drive let's you play around with different sprocket sizes and have more power in general.

    Right now I'm considering an ME1616 my primary motor candidate for my next build. That's probably way overkill for your frame though.

    Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

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  10. #9
    Senior Member Stevo's Avatar
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    You wont regret the ME1616...
    The power output and torque is amazing.
    Current rides: '96 Honda Ohlins VFR, '03 Cannondale C440R, '03 Cannondale Cannibal, '06 Yamaha 450 Wolverine 4x4
    Current builds: eVOR.v3.4
    WORX.VOR.v3.2

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