PDA

View Full Version : Liquid metal batteries



Spaceweasel
25 October 2012, 1142
http://www.ambri.com/storage/documents/ambri-brochure-web2.pdf

I was following up on the tech discussed on the Colbert Report and thought it might have some interesting applications to an el moto. They discuss 16in square cubes (perfect for between the frame rails!), but I don't think the liquid storage is suited for our sort of application.

Athlon
25 October 2012, 1518
one of the biggest problem of molten salt battery is the temperature , you will need very big insulation to separate the hot battery ( about 300) from the rest of the world. This insulator wall may be up to 20cm wide , so is impossible to use it on a bike , on a car a very similar technology ( Sdium Sulfur) was very competitive against Ni-Cd but lost against Litihium.
This type of battery are born for storage because they get cheaper and more efficient the bigger they are , the best size for a molten salt battery is in the range of a cube of a few meters of size

BaldBruce
25 October 2012, 1723
All good points on the Sodium family of batteries. The biggest challenge for an Elmoto besides size, would be that they are not very good sources of power. Very good energy sources, but very poor at delivering it quickly. GE now manufactures and uses a Sodium based battery for their hybrid locomotives. Perfect application where wieght and size are not critical, but huge amounts of energy storage are desired.

podolefsky
25 October 2012, 1956
Yeah, size is a pretty big obstacle - 16" square and 1200 Wh is about 20 Wh/L. For perspective, lead acid is 100 Wh/L. Lipo is >300 Wh/L. In other words, that battery would be 15x the size of the same capacity of lipo...

MIT researchers have been working on a battery that can be filled by using liquid cathode and anode, at room temperature (I'm not sure if this liquid battery technogocy has "vaporized" though...)

...and, um, Bruce? Where the hell have you been?

BaldBruce
25 October 2012, 2137
Spreading hate and disscontent..., doing my normal work.:)

Been working on my EV cars more. Sold my S-10EV and now have a 1988 Porsche 944. Bought it from a guy who had converted it, but used lead acid. Dead after abusing the batteries for 3000 miles. (Dead batteries that is:O. Proving once again, that exceeding the manufacturer's maximum C rate will only get you into trouble.) I'm in the middle of rebuilding the car with LiFePO4. Headways in the front and CALB in the rear.

Bike is completely operational, but is any project really ever completed????